We continue our comments on the manuscript sent to us by a Mormon called Stephen.(*) Click here to see the other articles in this series. You can also go to the Mormonism page to find all the articles that are in this refutation of Stephen’s document.
We will now discuss the issue of prophets. We will then examine the man, Joseph Smith, Junior, the first modern prophet to the LDSs.
Stephen doesn’t even make the distinction between Old Covenant prophets and New Covenant prophets… I am sure he will make a big mistake and assumption in this direction in the coming lines…
Joseph Smith is a prophet, yes, but a false prophet, because he wanted to add on the final revelation that came in the New Covenant. We have seen the details about what I just said in the article The Canon of Scripture.
“Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.” (Matt. 7:15) Does this mean there were to be no more prophets?
No, this means that there were to be false prophets and that we were to beware of them. Why were you not beware of Joseph Smith? Did you consider these words in Matthew 7 to be just light opinions that you could just despise?…
If there is a “false” anything, does it not make sense there would also be its “true” counterpart?
There ARE true counterparts. There are true prophets today who do not add to the final revelation that came in Jesus Christ, as we have seen. Joseph Smith tried to add to that final revelation, so that’s an enough proof he was a false prophet.
How can there be a counterfeit twenty-dollar bill if there is no such thing as a real twenty-dollar bill? Would a counterfeiter attempt to pass an eighteen-dollar bill? If this verse meant there would be no more prophets, would the Savior have needed to editorialize? And, if the Lord meant there were to be no more prophets, it would have been clearer for Him to say something such as, “If anyone says he is a prophet, believe him not. For there will be no more prophets.” Instead, the Lord chose to start out His careful warning with, “Beware!” Let us read on.
True. So why were you not beware of Joseph Smith who was clearly a false prophet?…
By the way, I am already sensing a false interpretation of the word “prophet”… Let me just remind the readers of the definition that we saw together in the article The Canon of Scripture:
People usually have a wrong understanding about who a prophet is: they think a prophet is someone who just predicts things about the future without any relation with any plan of God. The fact is that prophets are those who speak for God before the people, and all what they say is in relation with the eternal Plan of God which is always expressed within a covenantal form. In other terms, the prophets are not magicians who tell you whether you will win the lottery or not, or whether you will get married or not… they declare the revelations of God according to His Plan. The Old Covenant was the shadow of the substance, and in the times of the Old Covenant God had not yet said His final Word or revelation (cf. Hebrews 1:1-3), so the prophets of the Old Covenant were telling about what was to come in terms of the Old Covenant. Now that the Perfect and final revelation of who God is came (cf. John 1:18, Hebrews 1:1-3) we don’t need any new covenant anymore, and all the truth is revealed in Christ once for all, even what is to come. As has been explained before, Jesus Christ is the final revelation of God to mankind. In Him, all the prophecies are fulfilled, and they are not still waiting for their fulfillment (cf. Matthew 5:17). Even what is to come will fulfill prophecies according to what was already fulfilled in Christ, and not according to another covenant. Indeed, while God had spoken long ago to the fathers in many ways in the prophets, and yet in the last days He has spoken to us in His Son; and He will not speak to us in any additional way, as the Son is the radiance of His Glory and the exact representation of His Nature (cf. John 1:18 and Hebrews 1:1-3). There is no further revelation about God beyond the Son, as the Son is the perfect revelation of God:
“God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways,
in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.
And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high“ (Hebrews 1:1-3)
Today is not a period of new revelations, but a waiting period during which the Son is at the right hand of the Majesty on high, waiting until all His enemies are made a footstool for His feet (cf. Psalm 110:1). The purification of sins is already made once for all.
Long ago, God didn’t reveal Himself in His incarnated Son who is Himself the Gospel. The Book was sealed, and only Christ could break the seals. Although the prophets spoke of Him, and yet He was not revealed or manifested in flesh:
“that is, the mystery which has been hidden from the past ages and generations, but has now been manifested to His saints,
to whom God willed to make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.” (Colossians 1:26-27) Read also 1 Timothy 3:16.
This revelation in the Son was HIDDEN from the past ages and generations, and it was revealed to His saints in the apostolic age and for all coming generations ONCE FOR ALL:
“the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints.” (Jude 1:3)
It was ONCE FOR ALL handed down to the saints in the apostolic age and it is still the SAME revelation that we receive today. There is no new revelation. The whole full and final revelation of God in His Son already came in the apostolic age.
Now, after this once for all revelation that was received by the saints, the Apostle warns:
“even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed!
As we have said before, so I say again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed!” (Galatians 1:8-9)
No one should preach a new revelation, claiming that it is from God. If he does, then he is anathema or accursed according to the Word of God, and not a true prophet. The true prophets of the New Covenant will only preach before people the once for all received Gospel that we have in the Bible. Joseph Smith brought another gospel which is a false gospel and which is not even good news, as we have seen in details.
“Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:16-20) Why would the Lord go to so much trouble to help us distinguish true prophets from false prophets, unless He meant there would be true prophets?
Stephen, you’re wasting your time trying to prove something that we already know: yes, there are true prophets. True prophets do not appear only sometimes, but under the New Covenant there are always prophets in the Church, because that’s a gift given to the Church to build it. But we have seen that these true prophets do not add to the Word of God, while just like Muhammad Joseph Smith added to the Word of God; you will know him by his fruits… Why have you not known him? Is it because the Bible says: “whose coming is according to the working of Satan in all power and signs and wonders of falsehood, and in all deceit of unrighteousness to them that perish, because they have not received the love of the truth that they might be saved. And for this reason God sends to them a working of error, that they should believe what is false, that all might be judged who have not believed the truth, but have found pleasure in unrighteousness.” (2 Thessalonians 2:9-12)
John warned of false prophets in his first epistle. He told us, “Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: . . .” (1 John 4:1-3)
Yes, and we have seen how Jospeh Smith and Mormons deny that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. For more details about this, read our article: Should we associate with the Mormons?
John wrote this epistle, as mentioned earlier in this chapter, two years after he wrote the Revelation.
We have previously seen that this is irrelevant to this argument.
Did he also mean there would be no prophets by this time—98 AD?
No, he meant there would be false prophets and that we should be careful.
What is the definition of a prophet—a true prophet?
By the way: are you talking about Old Covenant prophets or New Covenant prophets?…
Here is the Biblical OT definition: A true prophet must prophesy of knowledge not yet known to man, which—with the passing of time—will be verified by the acquisition of said knowledge by man himself. (See Deut. 18:20-22.)
No, that’s not exact. Deuteronomy 18:20-22 is just talking about one aspect of who a prophet is. Let’s read it and see which aspect that is:
“But the prophet who shall presume to speak a word in my name that I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die. And if thou say in thy heart, How shall we know the word that Jehovah hath not spoken? When a prophet speaketh in the name of Jehovah, and the thing followeth not, nor cometh to pass, that is the word which Jehovah hath not spoken; the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: be not afraid of him.” (Deuteronomy 18:20-22)
Of course, Stephen considered the expression “speaketh in the name of Jehovah” just a beautiful ornament in this text, so he didn’t even try to understand what it means and what the text is talking about. “In the name of Jehovah” means “according to the Old Covenant, the Covenant made with Israel through Moses”. Yes, I am sure Stephen and some others are amazed of how I am reading this in those words, but let me explain it to them…
“And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, as the Almighty God; but by my name Jehovah I was not made known to them.” (Exodus 6:3)
Of course, Stephen does not know what “known” means here, so he will surely assume that the fathers did not know that the Name of God is Jehovah… But let’s see this together:
“And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovah-jireh; as it is said at the present day, On the mount of Jehovah will be provided.” (Genesis 22:14)
Oh, so Abraham knew the Name of God is Jehovah… So why did God tell Moses that Abraham and the fathers did not know Him by that Name? It is because “Jehovah” means “I am”, i.e. the One who does not change. By this Name God made the Old Covenant with Israel, because it means that He keeps the promises to their fathers as He does not change. So “Jehovah” is the Old Covenant Name of God. The prophets who spoke in the Name of Jehovah are those who prophesied according to the Old Covenant. We have seen the full explanation of this in our article The Canon of Scripture. The prophets of the Old Covenant prophesied about things to come according to the plan of God or the Old Covenant. And we know that the last prophet of the Old Covenant or of the Law is John the Baptist: “For all the prophets and the law have prophesied unto John.” (Matthew 11:13) Of course, by these words Jesus did not mean that there would not be prophets in the New Covenant, but He was talking about Old Covenant prophets who ceased with John the Baptist. After John the Baptist, the prophets who would come would not speak in the Name of Jehovah to tell about the Substance that was to come, but about the Substance, Jesus Christ, who has come, and they would reveal all coming things according to what was fully and finally revealed in the Son. We have seen the details about this in our article: The Canon of Scripture. And indeed, the Lord Himself said that the New Covenant prophets prophesy in the Name of Jesus Christ by which we have known God in the New Testament, and not by the Name of Jehovah which is the Name by which the Old Covenant people knew God: “Many shall say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied through thy name, and through thy name cast out demons, and through thy name done many works of power? “ (Matthew 7:22). As you see, the false prophets prophesy in the Name of Jesus, because their true counterpart prophesy in that Name, not in the Name of Jehovah as it was under the Old Covenant. Have you ever noticed that the New Covenant prophecies were all accepted in the Canon before they all came to pass, i.e. without making the examination of Deuteronomy 18:20-22?… This is because they are New Covenant prophecies that do not need to be judged according to the same standard of the Old Covenant.
So if Stephen thinks Joseph Smith brought new revelation, then that in itself is a proof that he was a false prophet, because new revelation could come only before the final revelation in the Son was fully given in the first century, as we have seen in details in our article The Canon of Scripture.
Of course, the rule of Deuteronomy 18:20-22 does apply to all prophets, if taken in the big picture of prophecy in general, because New Covenant prophecies also will all come to pass, until the second coming of our Lord and the last Judgment. But Deuteronomy 18:20-22 is not saying that if some predictions of a dreamer come to pass then automatically that dreamer is a true prophet! Deuteronomy 18:20-22 is saying that if even ONE prediction of a dreamer does not come to pass, then that prophet is a false prophet! As we will see later, some predictions of a false prophet may come to pass, as Deuteronomy 13 tells us, but Deuteronomy 18:20-22 tells us that even if some prophecies of that false prophet come to pass but others do not come to pass, then that prophet is a false prophet. So Deuteronomy 18:20-22 is against Joseph Smith, because many of his predictions did not come to pass, as we will see.
Let us look again at what the angel whom John almost worshipped had to say on the subject in the NT.
“And I (John) fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.” (Rev. 19:10; 22:9)
Yes, for the New Covenant prophets, it is the testimony of Jesus, the final revelation that came in the Son, that is the spirit of prophecy, so no New Covenant prophet will add to this final revelation that came in Christ. Even all what was written in the prophetic Book of Revelation was already included in the final revelation that came in Christ, therefore the angel told John that it is all in Christ. We have detailed this truth in our article The Canon of Scripture.
Prophets prophesy. That is what they do.
And prophecy is not only about the future, but it is to speak for God before the people. And we have seen what is the distinction between Old Covenant prophets and New Covenant prophets.
Remember when Peter quoted Joel on the day of Pentecost: “And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy.” (Acts 2:18)
And that’s exactly what happened: the Apostles prophesied before the people, i.e. they spoke for God before the people. They didn’t necessarily say things about the future, as Stephen hallucinates, but they told the people about Jesus who had already come, just as I have explained previously. Peter called that “prophesy” by quoting that prophecy about the coming of the Spirit and about God’s servants prophesying. Let’s read together what the Apostles were prophesying on that day: “we hear them speaking in our own tongues the great things of God“ (Acts 2:11). So prophesying was to speak the great things of God, i.e. what great things He has done, especially what He has done on the cross. Thus we see that Stephen is hallucinating about the meaning of prophecy. Plus, this passage in Acts 2 also speaks about other gifts that were given to the Church, but Stephen only wanted to single out prophecy, because he wants to deceive.
We know from verse seventeen, “those days” meant “the last days.”
We know from the context that Peter was explaining what was happening then, so this was about what happened on that Pentecost, not about what would happen in the times of Joseph Smith…
Plus, the Bible is clear about the last days: “God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.” (Hebrews 1:1-2). So the last days were already in the days Jesus came, i.e. in the days of the Apostles. Another verse and then we pass: “but when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, come of woman, come under law” (Galatians 4:4).
The fact John wrote the Revelation shows he himself was a prophet—a true prophet.
Yes, he was a New Covenant prophet, because he didn’t write in the Name of Jehovah, but in the Name of Christ, as we have seen.
Peter says there will be prophets in the last days. But how do we know if there are supposed to be prophets—especially now?
Peter quoted Joel saying that not just some prophets will prophesy in the last days, but that all the children meant by that prophecy would prophesy.
You’re trying hard to manipulate the verses to fit your corrupted doctrine…
“Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret (or ‘without revealing his plan’ in the NIV) unto his servants the prophets.” (Amos 3:7)
Yes, that’s under the Old Covenant. Under the New Covenant, the full revelation came in Christ, so there is no more need to wait to new revelations from God, because we’re not slaves anymore exactly for the reason that we have known the whole revelation about what the Father is doing: “I call you no longer bondmen, for the bondman does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things which I have heard of my Father I have made known to you.” (John 15:15)
Stephen, you really need to repent and to come to Christ in order to have the full revelation and be His friend, and cease to be a slave as you are now. The slaves will cling to any false prophet who claims to have a super-knowledge, and that’s what Mormons did by clinging to Joseph Smith. Cling to Christ instead.
Given the Lord will do nothing without first telling His prophets of His intentions, how can He accomplish all He said He would accomplish in these the Last Days without prophets?
Christ has revealed to ALL His true disciples all what God is doing, Stephen. We’re not slaves anymore; we’re not under the Old Covenant anymore. Yes, there are prophets today, but they don’t add to the final revelation that came in Christ. Joseph Smith added to the final revelation and claimed to have a super-knowledge that Christians did not have.
Do you know of any self-proclaimed Christian religion professing to be a “Restoration of All Things” through modern prophets who claim to receive new revelation other than the LDS Church?
The Word of Faith movement also claims to receive new revelation each day! You all are the heirs of Montanism which existed a long time ago. This rebellion against God’s truth is not new; do not be deceived. All sects claim that they are the restoration of the true Gospel. But we have seen that the Gospel will not need restoration, and we have seen what the restoration of all things is.
And since we have already covered the foreseen Apostasy and Restoration, whom would the Lord choose to carry it out?
We have seen that the apostasy already began in the days of the Apostles, so it’s not only about latter days, and we have seen that the restoration of all things will happen when Christ returns and makes all things new. There is no restoration of all things here; it will be after the final judgment happens and the new heaven and the new earth are made. And we have seen that the pure Gospel would always be kept in the world against apostasy by the clinging to the Word of God’s Grace.
Did His ministers give us any indication of His intentions about the structure and leadership of His Church?
Yes, His Apostles told us that the Church is an organism and not an organization as you imagine, and that the leaders should be servants and not lord it over the flock.
“And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief cornerstone; In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:” (Eph. 2:20,21) Is this all Paul had to tell the Ephesians about the organization of the Lord’s Church?
As you see, the Church is built on the one cornerstone, i.e. Christ, and on the one foundation of the Apostles and their companions the prophets who received the final revelation once for all in the first century. The Church is not destroyed and rebuilt on other apostles and prophets each time; it was once for all built on the Apostles of Christ and the prophets of Christ who received the final revelation once for all, the Faith which was handed down to the saints once for all: “Beloved, while I was making every effort to write you about our common salvation, I felt the necessity to write to you appealing that you contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints.” (Jude 3) This is why the Church is called Apostolic, because it is built on the truth that was handed down to us once for all from the Apostles of Christ.
“And he (Jesus) gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive.” (Eph. 4:11-14)
Yes, the twelve Apostles were given to the Church for the building of this Church, and that’s what they did once for all. That’s why the Book of Revelation mentions 12 gates and 12 foundation stones for Jerusalem (cf. Revelation 21:12 and Revelation 21:14), i.e. the twelve tribes of Israel as the foundation of the people of God in the Old Covenant and the twelve Apostles of Christ as the foundation of the Church. The prophets also are given for this purpose of building the Church, and they are given until now, but now they don’t receive any new revelation, because the final revelation was already given to the Apostles who are dead now. No one today has seen Jesus from the time He was baptized until His ascension to Heaven, so there are no Apostles today. We have seen the details about this in our article The Canon of Scripture. This strong foundation assures the unity of the believers which is not something that will happen in the future, but something that has already happened in the baptism with the Holy Spirit. We have seen the details about this in our article Is the Church one in purpose or in substance?
Are the saints (the members of Christ’s Church) perfect yet?
Yes, they were and will always be perfect, and this is assured by the once for all received revelation that we have in the Bible. Read about this in our article: A true Christian is a saint — Perfection in Christ.
Does it not specify these positions are necessary for the work of the ministry?
Yes, it does. But it doesn’t say that the foundation will be shaken and another foundation of other apostles and prophets will be made as Mormons have been deceived to believe. The Apostles and the new final revelation that came to prophets were necessary for the foundation of the Church. As you see in the above quoted passage, the Apostles and prophets were the foundation of the Church: “being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the corner-stone” (Ephesians 2:20). Now that the foundation is already put, we do not need to build a new foundation anymore, so we do not need Apostles and new revelations anymore.
Are we “all come in the unity of the faith”—one Christian Church?
No, Mormons are not one with the Church, but yes, the unity of the Church was assured by the work of God through those gift-men and other gifts which all were the evidences that God’s Word is true and that His promises do not fail; He is faithful. We have seen the details about this in our article Is the Church one in purpose or in substance? As God made only one foundation and one cornerstone, so there was no possibility that this foundation be changed. The Apostles received the once for all final revelation upon which the Church is built, and that’s how they are the foundation. If this foundation would be changed later, then it is not a foundation at all. We have seen how the Apostles were this foundation in our article The Canon of Scripture. The companion prophets of the Apostles are mentioned as this same foundation alongside the Apostles, because they received the same final revelation that the Apostles received, upon which the Church is built once for all so that it won’t be lost in human doctrines, as Paul explained in the passage from Ephesians that Stephen quoted. In Ephesians 4:13, “until we all arrive at the unity of the faith” doesn’t mean that this was not already done, but it is a style of speech to mean “all those gifts are for the purpose that we be in unity of faith all the time”; those gifts work in such a way that we are in unity of faith. This is proven by the fact that the Church is called the body of Christ and not just a part of His body, although she still didn’t reach “[the] measure of the stature of the fulness of the Christ”. Just as the body of a baby is a full body but needs to grow, in the same way the Church is the body of Christ and needs to grow in Him. In the same sense, the Church is one, but her unity needs to be kept as the body grows up, and this unity is always assured by the certainties of the one foundation that we have and that will never change and by the gifts that are the evidences of the power of God’s Word of Grace. Stephen imagines that the body is destroyed each time, and then new apostles and new prophets are needed to be the foundations of a new body. But this is not biblical, as we have seen, because the Church of Christ is one.
How many “winds of doctrine” are there in Christendom?
Many, one of which is Mormonism. We are kept from being tossed and carried about by all those winds, because we have a strong foundation, the Apostolic foundation. We are the “only one Universal and Apostolic [holy] Church” as the Creed declares.
I have asked obvious rhetorical questions whose answers are plainly written in these verses and known in the world. Yet I have felt the need to defend what the world considers fantastic claims. Why is it so hard to believe such an organization could exist today? Remember, “by their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20)
The Church is not an organization, but an organism, i.e. a body, and she exists today in the same way that is described in these verses. The Church is one, Universal, Apostolic, as we have seen. The details about this catholic Church are in our article The confusion about the catholic Church.
“Verily, thus saith the Lord concerning the wars that will shortly come to pass, beginning at the rebellion of South Carolina, which will eventually terminate in the death and misery of many souls; And the time will come that war will be poured out upon all nations, beginning at this place.” (D&C 87:1,2) The Lord revealed to Joseph Smith how the Civil War of the United States would break out. He then told Joseph how a world war, World War I, “will come.” Joseph Smith claimed to have received this information by revelation on December 25, 1832, decades before the commencement of the Civil War and eighty-two years before the commencement of WWI. He even described how the states would be divided and how Great Britain would assist the Southern States. The young LDS prophet went on to predict the turmoil to precede the Second Coming: “And thus, with the sword and by bloodshed the inhabitants of the earth shall mourn; and with famine, and plague, and earthquake, and the thunder of heaven, and the fierce and vivid lightning also, shall the inhabitants of the earth be made to feel the wrath, and indignation, and chastening hand of an Almighty God, until the consumption decreed hath made a full end of all nations;” (D&C 87:6) A number of these natural—and possibly manmade—disasters are yet to be fulfilled.
All of these are false prophecies. Note that the World War I did not begin in South Carolina… The assassination on 28 June 1914 of Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria, the heir to the throne of Austria-Hungary, was the proximate trigger of the war. I don’t think Austria is in South Carolina… Note that your dreamer said that that war would be poured out upon all nations, beginning at this place, i.e. in South Carolina… But even if some of the signs that he or any other dreamer predicts come true, we should not believe in that dreamer, because he contradicts the fact that the Canon of Scripture is closed and he leads us to worship false gods: “If there arise among you a prophet, or one that dreameth dreams, and he give thee a sign or a wonder, and the sign or the wonder come to pass that he told unto thee, when he said, Let us go after other gods, whom thou hast not known, and let us serve them, — thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams; for Jehovah your God proveth you, to know whether ye love Jehovah your God with all your heart and with all your soul. Ye shall walk after Jehovah your God, and ye shall fear him, and his commandments shall ye keep, and his voice shall ye hear; and ye shall serve him, and unto him shall ye cleave.” (Deuteronomy 13:1-4) Of course some of the things dreamers say will come to pass, usually when interpreted by the followers of those dreamers who do their best to interpret events as the accomplishments of those dreams. In this way, many who practice astrology, numerology, fortune telling, and other forms of divination, will tell people things and they will think what they said came to pass. Nostradamus is an important example of this, and in these days many such dreamers say things that come to pass. The Bible teaches us not to listen to such dreamers, even if something they said came to pass, because they teach us to go after other gods and to disobey the Word of God. Joseph Smith taught people to deny the true God of the Bible, as we have seen thus far and as we will still see. Such dreamers will have some predictions that come to pass, but when you examine their “prophecies”, you will find out that other things they predicted did not come to pass, as we have seen above in Joseph Smith’s dream that World War I would begin in South Carolina… Many similar things in the predictions of Joseph Smith and of other dreamers did not come to pass, but their followers justify this the same way Stephen did here: “A number of these natural –and possibly manmade –disasters are yet to be fulfilled”… Yes, this is the way of escape. As we have seen before, Deuteronomy 18:20-22 says that even if ONE prediction of a prophet does not come to pass, then that prophet is a false prophet, period. Joseph Smith was a false prophet, because many things he said did not come to pass. You have a clear example of this in his prediction that World War I would begin in South Carolina…
I should probably give another witness of Joseph Smith’s inspiration, as the Law of Witnesses requires at least two to bring a conviction and with two or three witnesses, “shall the matter be established.” (Deut. 17:6; 19:15) How is it Joseph Smith knew over 170 years ago tobacco, liquor, and other substances were bad for the body and moderation in diet and in the intake of meat would lead to a healthier and longer life?
Satan knows about all these natural characteristics of matter better than any scientist. Let’s assume that Joseph Smith knew these things, and let’s assume Satan told him. Can you prove that it is otherwise? You can’t. That’s how shallow are the signs of a false prophet.
The Muslims also interpret the Qur’an to have predicted many scientific facts that scientists are newly discovering. Does this mean the Qur’an also is God’s Word?… Stephen, your proofs reflect the level of deception in which you are…
Even if many things Joseph Smith said were true, this does not mean that he was a true prophet, as we have seen.
“Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days, I have warned you, and forewarn you this word of wisdom by revelation—That inasmuch as any man drinketh wine or strong drink among you, behold it is not good, neither meet in the sight of your Father, only in assembling yourselves together to offer up your sacraments before him. And, behold, this should be wine, yea, pure wine of the grape of the vine, of your own make. And again, strong drinks are not for the belly, but for the washing of your bodies. And again, tobacco is not for the body, neither for the belly, and is not good for man, . . . Yea, flesh also of beasts and of the fowls of the air, I, the Lord, have ordained for the use of man with thanksgiving; nevertheless they are to be used sparingly; . . . All grain is ordained for the use of man . . . And all saints who remember to keep and do these sayings, walking in obedience to the commandments, shall receive health in their navel and marrow to their bones; And shall find wisdom and great treasures of knowledge, even hidden treasures; And shall run and not be weary, and shall walk and not faint.” (D&C 89:4-20)
The Bible says strong drink is not good for your health, especially for your mind and for your walk with the Lord. Joseph Smith read that in the Bible, and yet he claims to have received this by revelation. He’s a liar.
Joseph Smith was born at the end of 1805… In 1826, the pure form of nicotine is finally discovered. Soon after, scientists conclude that nicotine is a dangerous poison. In 1836, New Englander Samuel Green stated that tobacco is an insecticide, a poison, and can kill a man. So when Joseph Smith was still young, science was discovering that tobacco is bad! Was not Joseph Smith lying when he said that he received this by revelation?!
There were all the time beliefs that eating meat is linked to something bad, especially among the legalists who do not eat meat on Wednesday and on Friday. So meat was already linked to something bad, and Joseph Smith did not discover something new! He lied when he said that he received this by revelation! Yes, maybe he received this by revelation from Satan…
But note the most important and dangerous part in Joseph Smith’s words: he said that those who do what he commanded about wine and tobacco and meat will find wisdom and great knowledge even of hidden things! How can one find wisdom and knowledge of hidden things by doing what Joseph Smith commands? Does the abstinence from such things have an intrinsic ability to give men wisdom and knowledge of hidden things?… Was Joseph Smith confusing awareness or consciousness with wisdom and with the ability to receive revelation?… Yes, when we drink much wine and we eat much meat, we may have a partial and even a big loss of awareness or consciousness, but what does this have to do with the loss of wisdom and knowledge of hidden things?… Joseph Smith was confused, but Mormons think he’s a prophet; that’s ironic…
There is no need to expound upon the benefits of abstinence from tobacco and alcohol.
Is receiving a knowledge of hidden things one of those benefits?…
Too much protein—especially red meat with its high saturated fat content—overworks the liver, which can lead to premature aging and to health problems. According to a fourteen-year study conducted at UCLA, LDS men—faithful LDS High Priests—live an average of nine and a half years longer than the average white American male. We suffer fifty percent less cancer than the average American. We suffer even less alcoholism and other addictions. And we suffer considerably less mental illness than the average American.
But you do suffer those illnesses nonetheless! Joseph Smith said if you abstain of those things, you will NOT suffer such things! Why are you still suffering of those illnesses? Are you not abstaining??…
As a police officer, I can tell you the majority of mental illness can be attributed to the abuse of alcohol and or other mind-altering drugs.
A police officer is not the right reference for mental illnesses. I prefer a neurologist… Neurology does not say that “the majority of mental illness can be attributed to the abuse of alcohol and or other mind-altering drugs”. This is a very subjective and uninformed statement from a police officer. This shows how much a cultist can be superstitious…
So, do you think you could place a value on almost a decade of healthier life—especially when you are getting up there in years? Would you not consider this a “hidden treasure” worth every minute of its time?
Is the Kingdom of God about eating and drinking and about a healthier life?!
Plus, what’s the relation of this offer of yours with the genuineness of Joseph Smith?!
How can we know this claimed revelation was from God?
We know for sure that it is not from God, as we have seen before. Joseph Smith was a false prophet.
“Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.” (Matt. 7:20) And what are the fruits of a prophet—true or false? A prophet prophesies.
A false prophet prophesies things that do not come to pass, and he tells people to go after gods other than the God of the Bible, as we have seen before. Joseph Smith meets the profile of such a false prophet, as we have seen.
“But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die [be executed—see Deut. 13:5]. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken? When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.” (Deut. 18:20-22) So, fulfilled prophecies are inspired of God and unfulfilled prophecies are not.
NO! This is NOT what is said by these verses. These verses say that ALL prophecies of a prophet should come to pass, or else he’s not a true prophet! Even if ONE prophecy of this prophet does not come to pass, then this prophet is a false prophet. This is not about true prophecies or false prophecies, but about true and false prophets! These passages tell us how to know a false prophet and not how to know a false prophecy!
And we have seen how Joseph Smith meets the profile of a false prophet.
Grace be with you!
Disciple of Jesus Christ